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What Should I Do?



james78
08-03-2009, 02:40 PM
Hi,
I am intrested in buying a Weldall 160P or a 200P unit.
I am leiry of buying an off brand welder. I had time to try one of the Harbor Freight ARC / TIG welders but was not impressed. The harbor Freight unit was a Chicogo Electric scrach TIG machine that sells for around $200 welded ok but not controlable.

Last year I called Longevity to inquire on a 200P or a 160P and was Quoted around $700 and $470. Today I called and was Quoted $1100 for the 200P and $900 for the 160P. This seems way to high. even after the fact I would have to pay $160 for 30 peice consumables and $60 for Tungston. I am as most people only wanting a welder for hobbie welding.
I looked at the pictures of the welders out of the packadgeand was dissapointed to see the glue mess and scrapes right out of the box.
I wanted to get some feedback from existing owners or either of these units Cost of operation how they perform what would be a fair offer. to me it looks like gouging up the prices for something that is not proven to last. But thats my .02.
Thanks
James

LONGEVITY
08-03-2009, 03:19 PM
Hello James,

Since last year our production and operating costs have increased. Our units now also come with a much longer warranty. As for the performance, we suggest you browse the threads and see for yourself what are units are capable of.

$1000+ is a big investment so it is a great idea to do some research before you buy. Honestly, with all the machine can do, you will save a lot of money in the end.

Best of luck

Gadget
08-03-2009, 03:47 PM
I have the 160P and consider it well worth the investment. I haven't run across any welding or cutting job I couldn't do with it. I too am a hobbiest so my projects are usually on the small side but still, the unit does exactly what I want it to do. I've had my unit for nearly two years now and am as happy with it now as I was on day one.
Dan

HerbD
08-03-2009, 04:21 PM
Hi James,
I too am a hobby welder. Overall the ability to weld is a plus to the several other hobbies I have, so cost was an important factor.

What I've found is that the cost of argon gas is more than the total I've spent on all other consumable supplies such as tungstens, cups or tips. A couple of spares to have just in case is a good thing but I haven't seen a need for big multiples (sets) of any one part or collection of parts. Although I could use more practice with TIG I have also found that many projects work just fine with regular arc welding. My Longevity LS200P is so much more versatile and smoother than my previous AC buzzbox. Now I can TIG weld stainless, aluminum and steel when needed, and for the mild steel (angle iron etc) projects I just use the arc welder side. Not all projects need to be aerospace quality.

After following several forums on various brands of welders (both domestic and imported) for a couple of months I zeroed in on Longevity as having the best customer support. I've only had one glitch with my machine, but it was fixed up (actually replaced) within a day! Couldn't ask for better service.

HerbD 8-)

KHK
08-03-2009, 05:40 PM
I have a 160P and love it!!! I am also a hobby welder. The only regret that I have is that I should have bought the 200P!! A few consumables is adaquate for the hobbist. A good selection of tungston is a good idea. No matter who's welder you buy these things are required.
Look into the try before you buy on this web site. If you live close to a person that is allowing people to work with there unit, that mayu be the answer.

Gadget
08-03-2009, 05:58 PM
I've felt the same way Keith but not because the 160 didn't do the job. You just can't have too much power.
Dan

KHK
08-03-2009, 07:34 PM
I was welding some 1/2 Al and thought that more power would be better. The customer would not let me post any picks.

james78
08-03-2009, 09:00 PM
how long have you had your units

Gadget
08-03-2009, 09:01 PM
I've had mine almost two years.

matteh99
08-03-2009, 09:36 PM
Do you need the plasma cutter option?

The ArcMate LW-200ACDC seems pretty much like the 200p minus the plasma cutter.

ArcMate LW-200ACDC | Longevity Plasma Cutters, Plasma Cutter Accessories, multipurpose units, welders (http://www.longevity-inc.com/details.php?id=8)

I bought a lc-520d instead of the 418 or 416 because I thought that running a more powerful machine at a lower setting would be better for it than running a smaller machine all out. That being said I haven't turned the amperage up over 40 amps for the stuff I normally weld. I have turned it up all the way just to see what it did and it worked fine.

I am happy with the LC-520. The fit and finish of the product could be better (sorry simon) but performance wise I haven't had any issues. There are little things like the LCD display doesn't quite match the numbers on the dial. Of course the Hobart TIG mate and millery syncrowave cost over twice as much and don't have a digital display at all. And are huge heavy transformer machines. I spend alot of time in the computer world so I would say the fit and finish is closer to Dell than Apple.

I have had my LC-520 for only a few months now. I know you probably want some one to say they have had their unit for 3 years without an issue.

KHK
08-03-2009, 10:10 PM
I have had mine about 9 mo. The longest one time use is about 7 hours. TIG Welding, 1 & 1/2 tanks of argon. My argon tank is about 5 Ft high 14 in dia. Total run time is about 2 weeks.

I use the plasma cutter quite often. To me the test of the machine is in continuse use,

james78
08-04-2009, 07:03 PM
I do like the fact that this is a multi purpose welding machine. I will use every function. Additionaly I would like to purchase the 200P. But I feel strongly that these units are grosely overpriced! An unproven name, Design, Dependility and Dead on arrival's. I am not impessed with the way the units come in the mail dented, scraped, glue pools. It is around a 100% mark up from last year. Sorry, Longevity operating manufacturing costs is a weak excuse. What it the unit keeps breaking in randome areas for the duration of five years? Is it worth replacing parts after that how much will that cost. If you want to get your name out work on quality not quantity.
I am an active duty Marine. I have for years used the Lincon and Miller machines at work for whatever I need. I would prefer to do it at home at my own leisure. But, I will not buy one of these machines for over $700 (that is my line in the sand). Usualy the guys at work will (copycat) and (keep up with the Jones's) but I would advise them not to buy something at a gouged up price.
I had the time to look at some of the overseas websites and see you can buy the same units in bulk orders 30-50 minimun for a fraction of the cost per machine in red, green, yellow,and blue. Seeing this has me wondering: Are the Longevity machines bought in bulk and individualy repackaged marked up to make a brutal profit? The 100% mark up un a year is an indicator to me.
When I was stationed in Japan you could buy stuff like this for around $100. I still have electronics that I bought a few years ago.That recently are new in the U.S. I tell my junior Marines all the time "Just because you can buy stolen parts for a fraction of new or used dosent mean you should. If you enable it it will continue". I am only speaking for myself. I mean no disrespect toward anyone. Lingevity, or any of the board members. I would like one of the welders. I belive it will work as advertised, but I will not pay an obvious inflated price. If there are discounts and promotions. Great, I would be intrested.
Thanks
James

Gadget
08-04-2009, 07:34 PM
You can get an immediate 25% discount by entering the contest through the forum. That should get it near your line in the sand.

Here is a quote from the contest announcement

"This will be the most demanding contest from our customers and forum members, but someone will win and we will deliver as always. This contest is definitely the most demanding one that Longevity has released! We will require 4 things for entry into the contest. Every single member that enters, if does not win, gets 25% off any website purchase!"

Link is here http://www.longevity-inc.com/forum/news-announcements/1149-longevity-weldall-ls-250pi-igbt-plasma-cutter-tig-arc-welder-contest-7-21-10-25-a.html

matteh99
08-04-2009, 07:48 PM
First of all I don't work for longevity.

Of course Longevity machines are bought in bulk and then resold. That is what retail is. I don't know the exact process they go through but I am pretty sure it involves buying a bunch of welders and reselling them. Do they own their own factories in china? I have no idea. But there very few companies that produce a complete product without outsourcing any of it. I also have no idea what their mark-up is but comparing prices with other internet vendors that sell similar machines Longevity's prices are comparable. Ransomd, Everlast, Riland, Giantech all sell similar products for around the same price. Most of the time Longevity's is lower from what I have seen. People want the best price and the best support. I worked at a computer store were our margin on products was less than %6. Every time we sold a computer the state made more in sales tax than the store did. After buying a computer people wanted a life time of free support and training. The retail busness would be great if you just had to sell stuff and never deal with customers. Buying machines in bulk is cheaper but what the heck would I do with 30 tig welders? Which supplier is best? Who would I call if one broke?

You probably all ready know all of that but I felt a bit like a rant.

I am happy to spend $700 on a longevity product instead of $3300 on pretty much the same welder. Then another $1700 if I want a 40 amp plama cutter. That is five grand vs $700. I wonder what miller's percent markup is?

Of course you could just be shopping for a deal and hoping to get the price down which is fine more power to you. Or go for the %25 discount. Like Gadget said.

Gadget
08-04-2009, 07:55 PM
You should also consider how strongly the customers here support the Longevity brand and Simon. We are not paid for our comments and are not on the Longevity staff, We truly are happy with what we have and our experience with Longevity and are happy to support the product and company. I think there is some value there. Also consider the 5 year warranty, I think that is one of the best in the import welder field if not the best.
Dan

matteh99
08-04-2009, 08:09 PM
Posting here isn't completely selfless. The more people who buy Longevity welders at full retail the greater the chances Longevity will be around to help if my welder breaks in the next 5 years :)

james78
08-05-2009, 08:36 PM
It dosent matter to me that I can enter a contest and wait till the contest ends to be considered for a discount or how strongly you are for Simon. It is the price that I am objecting. When your five year waranty expires the units will have inflated to the same prices as the Miller brand welders. lets see Simon love you back then.

Gadget
08-05-2009, 08:47 PM
James,
I cannot speak for Simon but I would be surprised if the Longevity units ever inflate to the price of the Miller welders. Simon knows quality, customer support, and price are the things that keep sales going.
I wish you luck in your welder purchase. I truly hope you are able to find what you want at the price you want to pay. If you do, please share some photos of your work.
Dan

james78
08-05-2009, 09:42 PM
I would buy a unit from Longevity. I would post pictures of completed prodjects to share with the bord members.

I dont exactly buy that the same people are posting feedback, Rather It looks more to the fact that you are geting something out of it. You might be friends, neighbors, or aquainted with Simon personally. not just happy go lucky that you have had a welder for a few months. not out using it but typing away?????

I would love to speek to Simon about the matter. I am clear on what I am willing to pay.

James

KHK
08-05-2009, 09:50 PM
Just for fun let's look at other things that we buy;
Bottled water 400% mark up
Computer 100% mark up
Property TAXES 100000% mark up

The point is that we pay retail prices for almost everything we purchase.
The question is "Value for the Dollar" If I drew a line in the sand for $50.00 for a new car, I will never get a new car. The Longevity equipment in my oponion is the BEST value for the Dollar.

Don't worry about the profit made by a company, worry about wether you want the prodict that they make, and is the price competive in the USA.

matteh99
08-05-2009, 09:59 PM
James,
I have only talked to Simon a few times on the phone and exchanged a few emails.
You a right the purpose of the contest is to promote people talking on the forum. I got started posting here because of the last contest and now I enjoy it. I am not a 100% supporter of Longevity. I think they sell a good product that could be improved. I complain about their website all the time.

If Longevity raises their prices to the same as miller and lincoln's you can start importing welders from china and under cut their prices.

LONGEVITY
08-07-2009, 01:05 PM
I would buy a unit from Longevity. I would post pictures of completed prodjects to share with the bord members.

I dont exactly buy that the same people are posting feedback, Rather It looks more to the fact that you are geting something out of it. You might be friends, neighbors, or aquainted with Simon personally. not just happy go lucky that you have had a welder for a few months. not out using it but typing away?????

I would love to speek to Simon about the matter. I am clear on what I am willing to pay.

James

James,

Our units are not marked up as high as you think. Our profit margins are where they need to be to continue operations and provide quality goods.

Anything cheaper, we risk of having a junk product. Therefore, our operating costs and manufacturing costs increased to output quality.

Our pricing will not increase to the levels Miller or Lincoln charges because we will not profit of the reputation of our name. Our goal is to provide affordable equipment that matches or surpasses the quality if Lincoln and Miller and we are on our way in achieving our goals.

I understand 1-2 years ago you received a quote for a certain price, but that quote cannot be obtained at this time because of manufacturing reasons as well as other costs.

You are still saving thousands of buying our machine vs another brand.

jbman45
08-17-2009, 06:39 PM
Well let me put in my 2 cents worth, only late because I've been out of the country for 6 weeks and just now catching up on my fun stuff which is this forum and using metal working stuff! And let me say first of all I haven't personally met Simon, nor been to their operations; but I bought an LS200P after evaluating many units and couldn't be a happier buyer. I have used many welders over 40 years including Miller, Lincoln, old Century, Harris and some no names. Technology has greatly improved and eventhough I can still box weld with my old AC.DC units, buying the multifunction unit gives me incredible flex. I never thought I needed the plasma cutter function but wow, what a great tool. I have electric hacksaws but the plasma is just great. And it's not important if it cuts 1/2 inch steel, who cares unless you're building a ship; it's all about good function on 1/4 or less; aluminum and all sorts of trimming jobs.

I'm real happy with the Longevity product and any questions I have had are promptly answered. I also had issues with a Miller Dynasty, out of warranty and for only $1000 they would replace the board and give me a 30 day warranty! Just great. I have other stories that would bore everyone also...but if it's about the price, you need to consider the support and service.

Also I see you challenge mfg costs from chinese and other mfgr's but you need to realize to buy a welder from them you're into a minimum of 30 to 50 units; have probably 100 each for shipping and essentially no warranty....so no, ya can't do that. If you're over there buy a unit cheap, but remember if something goes wrong you're in the same boat as I was with the Miller...pay the big dollars to get it fixed or trash it like I did. And remember the chinese will build whatever you want, doesn't have to work! It's all about you spec'ing out the product, quality control and continued business; all of which I trust Longevity to handle correctly to get good products for us.

so I've been happy with my purchase, good product, good service. You might find a unit a little cheaper but I guarantee you that you won't find a better support team when something goes wrong.

No foul, no harm...buy where you want but that's how I see it and I'm a happy customer in Houston, TX. Drop a note if you want, happy to provide any more info if you want.